Posts by Lee Elder

88

What was there before the Big Bang?

by Brokeback Watchtower in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpuhj98vjoa.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hik8hj0_t9q.

Lee Elder

Energy is probably a constant - having always existed. Given the right conditions it can become matter. Those conditions are largely a matter of speculation.

32

Watchtower set for its biggest pay day, ever.

by pleaseresearch in

if this is true, and we will have to wait and see.

prince could give everything to the watchtower.

so that's his $300 million fortune.

With such a large estate, Probate would be required in Minnesota regardless of whether or not there is a will. If his compound or other real estate was owned in "Joint Tenancy" it could pass directly to the other named owner/owners or "Joint Tenants" on the deed thus bypassing probate. The same would be true of jointly held accounts, payable on death accounts, or life insurance that names a beneficiary. If he had a total of $50,000 or less in personal property, then probate can be avoided. Obviously, that is not the case.

The term "probate" actually comes from the Latin "to prove", and refers to the legal process of proving that someone had a valid will. They had to "prove" their claim to the estate. My guess is that this will be a very complex probate process that could drag on for years.

31

Fade question: New Cong or stay.

by Darkknight757 in

i have a question with regard to fading.

the wife and i have plans to move to another hall and continue our fade from the organization.

we are already missing quite a few meetings and we are not reporting time.

Lee Elder

Try to move to a hall where the new elders will have to travel 30-45 minutes to reach you. They won't try too many times.

33

Where and What. . . IS THE EVIDENCE for "Mental ILLNESS"? ? ?

by Terry in

jw
friends

i have no interest whatsoever in stirring up controversy.. in fact, i find clashes of opinion to be debilitatingly negative.. so, i'd simply like to request that we narrow this discussion to evidence.. please watch this video which is tantalizingly titled :.

"there's no such thing as mental illness".. consider this data and listen to the presentation of cause vs. effects and give me your analysis and any evidence for conclusions you may draw.

we all have anecdotal tendencies, but i should remind you, anecdotal testimony isn't evidence, only opinion.________________________________________.

Lee Elder

It is hard to imagine any part of the human body that is not subject to disease, disorder, dysfunction, infection, etc. Why would the brain be the exception? No question in my mind that mental illness is real. Quite a bit of it can now be shown on an MRI or PET Scan.

40

I went to see my Dr about the blood card issue

by purrpurr in

i booked a double appointment so that she wouldn't be rushed.

i explained that i'd been brought up in the jw's and woken up to what a load of shite it was.

i explained that they have changed the blood card and that the elders in the cong are being told to effectively force people into signing it.

Lee Elder

For some reason, point number one appears to have not published correctly. Will try again:

1. If your doctor employs or hires a nurse, assistant or office worker, you should be aware they will have access to your medical records (same things goes for hospitals). If the individual happens to be a JW, and they are aware that you are a JW who does not support the policy, or have used blood products not presently approved for use by Watchtower, they may feel compelled to report you to the elders as they hold divine law to be more important than human laws like HIPPA or the equivalent. Watchtower has previously commented on this issue, and Dr. Muramoto discussed it in one of his articles in the journal of Medical Ethics. All of those articles can be found in the Physicians section of AJWRB.

40

I went to see my Dr about the blood card issue

by purrpurr in

i booked a double appointment so that she wouldn't be rushed.

i explained that i'd been brought up in the jw's and woken up to what a load of shite it was.

i explained that they have changed the blood card and that the elders in the cong are being told to effectively force people into signing it.

Lee Elder

A couple of things that its good to be mindful of.

2. The Watchtower has on at least one occasion required many thousands of Jehovah's Witnesses to present their pocket size advance directive as a form of I.D. I would not be surprised to see this used again in certain situations, and would be a pretty simple loyalty test. The last time they did it, they reported that as many of 50% of those checked had not signed their card or had it witnesses.

Lee

9

Question about the new blood card

by Truthexplorer in

ok......i really need to know the answer to the following question and scenario.

supposing a child at age 14 decides to get baptized.

the child is then given the new blood card which has now tightened things up with respect to lawyers etc.

Lee Elder

This will vary depending on the location/existing laws, and the attending physician. We have seen cases where the physician speaks with the minor, and makes a decision to respect the minors wish to not accept a prohibited transfusion. However, in most the cases the physician has the legal authority to proceed with the transfusion of a minor in an emergency regardless of the parent or child's wishes.

The real danger to fourteen year olds (and other adolescent JWs) is having cancer or some blood disorder that eventually will require a prohibited transfusion to treat. In these cases, Watchtower has had success in getting courts to grant "mature minor" status, and prohibit their receiving medically necessary care. The 94 Awake has many examples.

241

Another generation....

by joey jojo in

it has been 21 years since the 1995 article that pretty much buried the idea of the '1914 generation'.. remember those guys?

the ones born in 1914 that would still be alive when the end of the system arrived.. i'm glad i'm old enough to remember going from door to door, preaching this belief.

the reason i say that is because i have a lot of 'still in' jw friends and family.

Lee Elder

I can remember giving the public talk on the generation of 1914 to many different congregations. I was the Watchtower Study conductor when this article came out, and it hit me between the eyes like a brick. My thought was, if they could be wrong about something so important and prominent in their theology, they could be wrong about other important things as well. The first thing I decided to carefully investigate was the blood issue, and it didn't take too long to figure out they had missed the whole point there as well, with even greater negative consequences. This article was the beginning of the end for me.

34

My last meeting as an elder

by Lee Elder in

jw
friends

the thread on judicial committes reminded me of my last meeting.

as a jw elder.

a major rift had developed on the body of elders.

Lee Elder

Commenting here because this was a pretty interesting thread that stopped 14 years ago. Its definitely worth a read and further comments from others on their last meeting as an DO, CO, elder, MS, publisher, etc.

36

Coming to terms with the Watchtower experience

by Lee Elder in

it is a challenge coming to terms with your experience as a jehovah's witness.

if you were born and raised as a jw, and your parents were true believers, the impact on your life is profound, lasting, and largely negative.

in some cases quite abusive emotionally, spiritually, financially, educationally and yes, even sexually.. i recently watched "trumbo", and was quite moved by dalton trumbo's speech to the screen writers guild in 1970. here is an excerpt that i think is quite relevant to this topic:.

Lee Elder

Interesting comments. I think a few of you are misunderstanding what I was saying. When someone does something wrong or evil, they are damaging their soul or person. They may not realize it at the time, but its nonetheless true. Ray was guilty of this, I was guilty of this, and probably many of you were as well.

Are there some in the Watchtower who are aware that they are damaging others with their actions, speech, policy, etc? Yes, I am certain there are. Do some of these individuals know the truth about the truth? I would say yes. Are they motivated by a lust for power? Almost certainly.

My sense is that Ray Franz was a true believer for most of his time as a Jehovah's Witness. I know I certainly was. There is little question in my mind that there are others, perhaps a significant majority of the leadership who are true believers. That doesn't change the effect of what they are doing, only changes the context. Its the kind of factor that comes into play at the sentencing level in criminal cases. They've victimized others and they have also been victims.

As for anyone who aware of the history of the organization, and the level of damage that its doing, and chooses to stay and support it, and go so far as to lust for power and prestige (at any level of the organization), that is a special kind of evil. They've been damaged and victimized by the process of growing up, and chosen to continue the cycle despite having knowledge. I think this is a very small group of narcissists and sociopaths. How many of the governing boy would fit this description I can't say.

My post was simply about how I try to come to terms with my experience. I've been out for nearly twenty years now. I didn't have to go to jail like Dalton Trumbo did. However, there are quite a few similarities in the experiences, and I found some peace from reflecting on his words. I hope you did as well.